31. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Jun 22, 2023 Jonny Farmelo Bill Kamenjar/InsideNoVa. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. While Farmelo is certainly an intriguing prospect for his. RHP/DH Bryce Eldridge, James Madison (VA) HS. Each of these prospects received a signing bonus of at least $1. September 18, 2023. No. 1. Jonny Farmelo, who announced his commitment to play baseball at UVA back in July 2020, is ranked the No. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Mariners select OF Jonny Farmelo and SS Tai Peete back-to-back in MLB Draft with picks 29 and 30 An immediate injection of young talent to the farm as the. Jonny Farmelo, OF, Westfield (Va. 645 with five home runs in 14 games played. Looking at players who fit there in terms of talent, I come up with three: Virginia Tech's Jack Hurley, Virginia high schooler Johnny Farmelo and Mississippi State's Colton Ledbetter. The Mariners are in agreement with 29th pick Johnny Farmelo on a $3. Farmelo has speed to his game, and can also hit very well, and. October 21, 2023. Farmelo attended Westfield High School in Fairfax County, Virginia. 31. Seattle Mariners: Sammy Stafura, SS, Panas HS (New York) 31. A highly-touted recruit from Centreville, Virginia, Farmelo is expected to arrive at UVA next fall, but could decide to go straight to professional baseball instead. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Jonny Farmelo. 31. Madison senior pitcher/first baseman Bryce Eldridge (21) and Westfield center fielder/shortstop Jonny Farmelo (48) both rank in the top 50 on the draft prospect list on MLB. Recorded a 6. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. He’s a plus runner, which helps him on both sides of the ball, and has. Multi-sport athlete, a lot of quick-twitch in him. Jake Gelof Pick: 2nd round, No. 20. 31. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. Saturday's top prospect performers. 385 (51x126) with 60 runs scored, 22 doubles,Day one was a massive success for your Seattle Mariners. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Julio Rodriguez. Shortstop/third baseman Colt Emerson combines hitting ability and power potential, outfielder Johnny Farmelo is a speedster with a promising bat and shortstop Tai Peete had perhaps the quickest bat in the high school class as well as plus raw power, speed and arm strength. Sure, the club finished with a losing record for a second consecutive season, but there was progress after the 94-loss 2019 campaign. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. The third edition of the event will. Primary outfielder who is a really good mover with fluid, athletic actions. Mariners: Jonny Farmelo, OF, Westfield HS (VA) Pick value: $2,800,700 Signing bonus: $3,200,000 After a little more than a week following Day 1 of the Draft, the Mariners and Farmelo's agents reached an agreement that was well over slot value to secure the high school bat. 29 overall pick Jonny Farmelo for $3. 31. The Westfield High School (Virginia) product takes Cory McCart. 29. Jonny Farmelo, Virginia's top baseball commit in the recruiting class of 2023, was selected by the Seattle Mariners with the No. Farmelo, a left-handed hitting outfielder out of a Virginia high school, tops the $2. Wake Forest right-hander Teddy McGraw (third round) showed. The hours before the 2023 MLB Draft kicks off are dwindling and time is running out for teams to try to line up their Draft boards. Wake Forest right-hander Teddy McGraw (third round) showed. The Astros held the 28th pick, and I think all Seattle fans think the same about. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. Watch. 07/19/2023: Seattle Mariners signed OF Jonny Farmelo. A general view of the MLB Draft stage as the Seattle Mariners select Johnny Farmelo. OF Jonny Farmelo assigned to Modesto Nuts from Mariners Organization. 8MM slot value of the. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. Keep it Clean. 20. Johnny Farmelo, OF, Mariners Westfield HS, Chantilly, Va. Farmelo, who was selected with the No. Farmelo is a well-rounded, lefthanded-hitting outfielder who continued to grow on scouts throughout the summer and fall thanks to his hitting ability and solid set of tools. 20. Elite run tool, athleticism, physical, left handed hitter, and can stay in centerfield. 29. 29th overall selection Johnny Farmelo and 20th-rounder Will Watson are the only players who. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. 29 overall pick in the 2023 MLB Draft on Sunday night. Top high school talent set to wrap up States Play Invitational. May 14, 2023. GameChanger is the best free mobile Prep Baseball scorekeeping application, used by. 20. In his high school career, he recorded a . The Seattle Mariners, who drafted the UVA commit with the 29th pick in the first round, signed Farmelo with a signing bonus for a total deal of $3. ⚾️ ONE. . Tyler Locklear collects three hits on Saturday. Image credit: (Photo by Zach Lucy/Four Seam) Major League Baseball and USA Baseball announced the participating players in the 2023 MLB Draft combine today. Three D. 20. 385/. 34 second 60-yard dash time. com. Farmelo, a left-handed hitting outfielder out of a Virginia high school, tops the $2. 20. Get expert fantasy help on who to draft: Aidan Miller or Jonny Farmelo. “In our draft chat published this morning on @LookoutLanding, I had comped one of my favorite players in the draft, Jonny Farmelo, to Christian Yelich. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. 1:53. (Westfield High) Drafted: Prospect Promotion Incentive pick, No. ly/3XYVKUh. ) HS. Mariners affiliate. CF — SEA. 1-on-1 with Westfield outfielder Jonny Farmelo. . Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. 20. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. In May of 2021, Jon became a member of Webb Companies Board of. “Farmelo is a well-rounded left-handed-hitting outfielder who continued to grow on scouts throughout the summer and fall thanks to his hitting ability and solid tools. Jonny Farmelo, OF, Westfield (Va. Joe Doyle is joined by Westfield High School outfielder Jonny Farmelo. 19,076 765 113. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. – The Seattle Mariners have selected outfielder Jonny Farmelo out of Westfield High School (Chantilly, VA) with their second selection (29th overall) in the 2023 MLB First-Year Player Draft, Director of Amateur Scouting Scott Hunter announced tonight. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. 31. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. Farmelo was committed to play college baseball at the University of Virginia. April 27, 2023 | 00:00:42. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. The Mariners are in agreement with 29th pick Johnny Farmelo on a $3. Also on Monday, former UVA baseball commit Jonny Farmelo, who was Virginia's top recruit in the class of 2023, signed a deal with the Seattle Mariners. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Shortstop/third baseman Colt Emerson combines hitting ability and power potential, outfielder Johnny Farmelo is a speedster with a promising bat and shortstop Tai Peete had perhaps the quickest bat in the high school class as well as plus raw power, speed and arm strength. MLB Top Prospects. Of his 51 hits, he had 22 doubles. April 27, 2023 | 00:00:42. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. A star. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. 31. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. "Two Pitchers Work Together in No-Hitter as Canes National/NY Mets Scout Team 17u Beats Texas Twelve" Follow live play-by-play, scores and stats on Canes National/NY Mets Scout Team 17u at Texas Twelve. 426/. The Mariners have agreed to terms with all but two draft choices, reports Daniel Kramer of MLB. August 24, 2022. Pick value: $2,800,700. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. MLB Draft. Jonny Farmelo is a 2023 OF/SS with a 6-2 200 lb. “We see Jonny developing into a middle-of-the-order bat that will hit for both average and power, as well as make things happen with his elite speed,” Scott Hunter, Mariners director of amateur scouting, said in a news release. Modesto then tied the game with a three-run top of the fourth. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. Jonny Farmelo, OF, Westfield HS, Chantilly, Va. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. 20. 31. 20. 31. 2MM bonus,. Those three states are the usual suspects for producing the most. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Looking at players who fit there in terms of talent, I come up with three: Virginia Tech's Jack Hurley, Virginia high schooler Johnny Farmelo and Mississippi State's Colton Ledbetter. These '25 and '26 Draft prospects stood out at States Play. 8MM slot value of the. SEATTLE -- The Reds had poor luck in MLB's inaugural Draft Lottery last December. We would like to show you a description here but the site won’t allow us. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Get the latest Jonny Farmelo fantasy baseball news, stats and injury updates, player profile, fantasy rankings, daily matchup ratings, DFS projections and more. 31. Farmelo has speed to his game, and can also hit very well, and. 385/. Eldridge comes in as a dual threat pitcher and hitter, and is looking to do the same at the next level. Looking at players who fit there in terms of talent, I come up with three: Virginia Tech's Jack Hurley, Virginia high schooler Johnny Farmelo and Mississippi State's Colton Ledbetter. The Mariners are in agreement with 29th pick Johnny Farmelo on a $3. Future Focus: TG Dbacks. 38. Watch as the live game is scored. 546/. With Emerson, they form a trio of higher-risk, perhaps higher-upside players the Mariners. 20. 29 overall pick in the 2023 MLB Draft on Sunday night. Check out Jonny Farmelo's high school sports timeline including updates while playing basketball and baseball at Westfield High School (Chantilly, VA). GameChanger is the best free mobile Prep Baseball scorekeeping application, used by. The Mariners earned the 29th overall pick in the draft as a result of Julio Rodríguez winning the Rookie of the Year Award after being named in at least 2-of-3 top 100 prospect lists from ESPN , MLB. . The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. Offense front and center in Game 1 of. data visualization. Also contributing to the blowout was 18-year-old Johnny Farmelo, one of this year’s first round draft picks by the Mariners, who smacked a three-run shot earlier in the innings. Team Date Transaction; September 12, 2023: OF Jonny Farmelo assigned to Modesto Nuts from Mariners Organization. The Mariners are in agreement with 29th pick Johnny Farmelo on a $3. On Friday, sports reporter Jake Rohm spoke with West…A reminder that power was supposed to be the one tool that Jonny Farmelo hasn’t quite developed yet, so this is a pleasant surprise. Large, athletic frame with an. Also on Monday, former UVA baseball commit Jonny Farmelo, who was Virginia's top recruit in the class of 2023, signed a deal with the Seattle Mariners. September 24, 2023. Search for a specific player using the below. Shortstop/third baseman Colt Emerson combines hitting ability and power potential, outfielder Johnny Farmelo is a speedster with a promising bat and shortstop Tai Peete had perhaps the quickest bat in the high school class as well as plus raw power, speed and arm strength. We're going to see what happens when a fan takes control of the team and runs it FOR THE PEOPLE. September 18, 2023. OF Jonny Farmelo assigned to USA Baseball 18U National Team. 8MM slot value of the. 423/. . He struck out just 25 times and had 41 walks. Mariners draft OF Farmelo No. 31. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. September 25, 2023. A profile of Jonny Farmelo, a high school outfielder from Virginia who could be available when the Dodgers pick at No. Wyatt Langford, OF, Florida: Langford is coming off a phenomenal season that saw him hit . 39 prospect in the draft: Farmelo is a physical athlete with a lot of tools to like. Jul 17 2023 Signed a contract with Seattle (SEA) Jul 9 2023 Drafted by Seattle (SEA): Round 1 (#29 overall) Jonny Farmelo contract details, salary breakdowns, payroll salaries, bonuses, career earnings, market value, transactions and statistics. Looking at players who fit there in terms of talent, I come up with three: Virginia Tech's Jack Hurley, Virginia high schooler Johnny Farmelo and Mississippi State's Colton Ledbetter. 20. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. Watch as the live game is scored. Elite run tool, athleticism, physical, left handed hitter, and can stay in centerfield. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Farmelo, 18, batted . PLEASE TURN OFF YOUR CAPS LOCK. com Jonathan Thomas Farmelo (born September 9, 2004) is an American professional baseball outfielder in the Seattle Mariners organization. ) High outfielder Johnny Farmelo with the 29th pick and Trinity. Modesto. Minor League Baseball. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. Wake Forest right-hander Teddy McGraw (third round) showed. Once drafted by the Nationals, Crews impressed in the Florida Coast league then up in Low-A Fredricksburg where he slashed . The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. He’s a plus runner, which helps him on both sides of the ball, and has shown the ability to find the barrel consistently and drive the ball to all fields. 20. 31. 31. Click a statistic to view all values equal or higherLooking at players who fit there in terms of talent, I come up with three: Virginia Tech's Jack Hurley, Virginia high schooler Johnny Farmelo and Mississippi State's Colton Ledbetter. Drafted in the 1st round of the 2023 MLB Draft by the Seattle Mariners, Jonny Farmelo was one of the top high school prospects in his class. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. CF,RF,DH — NYY. Seattle Mariners 2023 MLB Draft Tracker: Every M’s pick. Large, athletic frame with an excellent combination of twitch and present strength. 16 overall. Looking at players who fit there in terms of talent, I come up with three: Virginia Tech's Jack Hurley, Virginia high schooler Johnny Farmelo and Mississippi State's Colton Ledbetter. September 18, 2023 | 00:00:43. News. 20. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. Farmelo was a Virginia commit. 06/15/2023: OF Jonny Farmelo assigned to College Workout. They had earned the 29th pick due to Julio Rodriguez being on the roster to start the season on his. For the next ten days, we will countdown three profiles a day, uJonny Farmelo cranks first pro homer to center field. Keep it Clean. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. August 24, 2022. Prior to this position, Jon was the Company’s Vice President of Operations, where he ran the day-to-day operations and oversaw the financial management of the Company. 29 overall pick Jonny Farmelo for $3. 2024 MLB Draft 2024 MLB Draft. Michael Arroyo led off with a single before Tatem Levins’ double put runners on second and third to end Cumming’s night. Born: ( 2004-09-09) September 9, 2004. Trevor Pedro | Nov 18, 2023. 15MM, Callis reports ( on Twitter ). On Friday, sports reporter Jake Rohm spoke with Westfield High School outfielder Jonny Farmelo, who’s a top 50 prospect in the upcoming draft. 20. 20. 31. Outfielder. Get to know Tai Peete here at Sea Level!The Mariners are in agreement with 29th pick Johnny Farmelo on a $3. 20. frame from Centreville, VA who attends Westfield HS. Jonny Farmelo; 18U National Team Training Camp; OF | L/R | 6-2/205 | DOB: 9/9/2004; 2022 18U National Team Training Camp. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. OF Jonny Farmelo assigned to Modesto Nuts from Mariners Organization. Shortstop/third baseman Colt Emerson combines hitting ability and power potential, outfielder Johnny Farmelo is a speedster with a promising bat and shortstop Tai Peete had perhaps the quickest bat in the high school class as well as plus raw power, speed and arm strength. 2. 29 this month and selected outfielder Johnny Farmelo, Peete's former roommate. ” Emerson, Hunter said, could play any of shortstop, second base or. Cincinnati held out some mildThe Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. A star during the summer of 2022, Farmelo possesses one of the loudest bats on the high school side of things for the 2023 MLB Draft class. com By combining plus defense and speed with loud contact at the plate, Jonny Farmelo has seen his draft stock rise exponentially since. 2024 Mock Draft; 2023 MLB Draft 2023 MLB Draft. His upside might be higher as. CF Jonny Farmelo has signed with the Mariners for $3. The Rangers, Rockies, Tigers, A’s and Orioles all agreed to $4MM+ bonuses with their first round draftees this afternoon. The hours before the 2023 MLB Draft kicks off are dwindling and time is running out for teams to try to line up their Draft boards. Virginia recruit, Jonny Farmelo, gets us to #17 in the Most Viewed Profiles of 2022. Kyle Manzardo, Ryan Bliss send Peoria to Fall League final. 20. Miller and White are high school options. Blue Jays: Thomas White, LHP, Phillips Academy, Andover, Mass. In his high school career, he recorded a . Rule Changes Probable Pitchers Starting Lineups Transactions Injury Report World Baseball Classic MLB Draft All-Star Game MLB Life MLB Pipeline Postseason History Podcasts. Jeff Farmelo is the father of Jonny Farmelo, an outfielder for the University of Virginia. A star during the summer of 2022, Farmelo possesses one of the loudest bats on the high school side of th. 20. Westfield High School outfielder Jonny Farmelo, 18, is headed to the Seattle Mariners as the No. In a piece at Baseball America,. Pitcher Dylan Questad and center fielder Jonny Farmelo speak after the teams 6-1 win over Titans Blue in the WWBA 17U Championship pool play game on July 10. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. At 29 and 30, it was Virginia outfielder Jonny Farmelo and Georgia shortstop Tai Peete, respectively. Jonny Farmelo, OF, Sr. We would like to show you a description here but the site won’t allow us. 9 Mariners prospect Jonny Farmelo hits his first professional home run for Single-A Modesto. Farmelo has a solid blend of tools and baseball ability, as well as a lean and projectable 6-foot-2, 200-pound frame with solid strength now. Hey r/Mariners, I'm running an Out of the Park Baseball 24 simulation on the Seattle Mariners. Seattle MarinersSEATTLE, Wash. Jonny Farmelo, OF, Virginia (No. 31. Jonny Farmelo; 18U National Team Training Camp; OF | L/R | 6-2/205 | DOB: 9/9/2004Jonathan Thomas Farmelo. September 24, 2023. Pack, Willits take home States Play Invitational MVP honors. The Mariners are in agreement with 29th pick Johnny Farmelo on a $3. Per club policy, the terms of the contract were not disclosed. These '25 and '26 Draft prospects stood out at States Play. Jonny Farmelo, Westfield HS, Chantilly, Va. Video Search Statcast MLB Network. Jose Ramirez. The Mariners are in agreement with 29th pick Johnny Farmelo on a $3. Four players saw a rise of over 50 spots in the ranks into the top 50, including David Mendez (Independence, Dayton commit), Josiah Seguin (Deep Run, William & Mary commit), and Zyhir Hope (Colonial Forge, Uncommitted)Mariners draft OF Farmelo No. Farmelo, a left-handed hitting outfielder out of a Virginia high school, tops the $2. Three player comps for Mariners 29th Pick, OF Jonny Farmelo. 20. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he’s also the best left-hander available and there’s a sneaking suspicion that he’s. It was right before this pick that the highlight of the entire night happened. 38. com ; on Twitter: @A_Jude . The signing bonuses for the selections through competitive balance round A in the 2023 baseball amateur draft: First Round. Pittsburgh Pirates, Paul Skenes, RHP, LSU. May 14, 2023. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. 20. (Taylor Jacobs/Seattle Sports) The Seattle Mariners went with high school hitters with each of their first three picks of the. . . | 1,847 MLB PLAYERS | 13,893 MLB DRAFT SELECTIONS. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. The Mariners used the pick they were awarded for Julio Rodriguez winning Rookie of the Year honors wisely, taking the physical and athletic Farmelo, who had a lot of helium as the Draft approached. Farmelo, a left-handed hitting outfielder out of a Virginia high school, tops the $2. Inside Jonny Farmelo's jump to one of the top players in the Class of 2023. Writer: Carlos. “Farmelo is a well-rounded left-handed-hitting outfielder who continued to grow on scouts throughout the summer and fall thanks to his hitting ability and solid tools. 31. 1-on-1 with Westfield outfielder Jonny Farmelo #DCNNGameNight. 1:06. Created with Sketch. Farmelo, who was selected with the No. Eldridge enters the cycle as one of the best two-way prospects in the class. 31. 60. com's Daniel Kramer. 385 (51x126) with 60 runs scored, 22 doubles, 1 triple, 7 home runs and 29. Wake Forest right-hander Teddy McGraw (third round) showed. The Rays like Peete and prep outfielder Johnny Farmelo, though both should get to them at No. Get the latest Jonny Farmelo fantasy baseball news, stats and injury updates, player profile, fantasy rankings, daily matchup ratings, DFS projections and more. Offense front and center in Game 1 of. A speedy center fielder with an unusual swing who still gets results, including against some of the top high-school pitchers in the draft. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. 20. The Mariners have selected Farmelo with the 29th overall pick in the 2023 First-Year Player Draft. I'm writing this before I head over to Chase Field for the second day of MLB Draft Combine workouts, so this edition of the Inbox will reflect that I have a severe case of Draft fever . “Jonny Farmelo is a top of the class runner right now. October 22, 2023. On Sunday, the Mariners went with high schoolers with each of their first three picks as the draft took place on their doorstep, taking infielder Cole Emerson (No. Farmelo, who committed to the University of Virginia in 2020, posted a . 2MM bonus,. A potential Day 1 pick in July’s MLB draft, the speedy Virginia commit hit . The 6-foot-2, 200-pound Farmelo is one of the top players in the Commonwealth and is ranked as a top-100 prospect for this year’s draft, ranking at No. 38. 16 overall. White faltered in his final start in late May before a large crowd of scouts, but he's also the best left-hander available and there's a sneaking suspicion that he's. Mariners' Bliss extending breakout campaign in Fall League. Looking at players who fit there in terms of talent, I come up with three: Virginia Tech's Jack Hurley, Virginia high schooler Johnny Farmelo and Mississippi State's Colton Ledbetter. Jonny Farmelo loved everything about the University of Virginia’s baseball program, but in the end, the lure and the money of Major League Baseball was too much to overcome for the Cavaliers. 8MM slot value of the. Farmelo is more power over hit right now which Yelich isn’t, but the loads, frame, etc.